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Using EMS for Fall xc, winter/spring sprinting?

Using EMS for Fall xc, winter/spring sprinting?

Postby rich121 » Thu Jul 05, 2012 2:38 pm

Hello,

I have a daughter who just turned 15 that runs cross country in the Fall, but trains and runs sprints the rest of the year.
Sprinting is her "love", she runs xc for the competition and comradery of the team.

Last year, as a Freshman at State, she ran the tough course in 20:15

Her 100m/200m sprints suffered badly this year due to a poor sprint program, as this is a "distance" based High School.
We plan to do our own training this winter to better ready her for sprinting and she will also run in a few indoor winter meets.

Her biggest love of sprinting involves the open 400m.
Her best time as a Freshman is 59.47

I bought a Globus "Speed Coach" custom programmed EMS to use mostly for recovery, that is until this winter, we will use it's full potential for sprint training.

In a couple weeks summer track (AAU/USATF) will be over and my daughter will start training with the xc team.
I was wondering, if it would be detrimental to use the endurance training programing during cross country, then switching to the sprint programming this winter?

Would this working with the slow twitch during cross country have a great negative effect on the working with building fast twitch in the winter?

Starting the beginning of November, she will start her GPP sprint training, including weights.
January/Febuary she will run in a few indoor meets, then end of Febuary the regular High School season starts.

I welcome your suggestions and expertise on the use of EMS for both of these running sports.
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Re: Using EMS for Fall xc, winter/spring sprinting?

Postby casey-becker » Fri Jul 06, 2012 2:22 pm

Hi rich121,

It seems that you are familiar with NMES use, that’s great! Getting right to your questions, I will briefly say that it is my opinion that you are certainly on the right path.

Whatever you are doing with your conventional training, you want to “mirror” with your Compex, or NMES training. I do not feel that it would be detrimental at all to do as you describe. In fact, I think this is a wise approach.

The Endurance program is going to be targeting those Type I muscle fibers, which is going to be ideal for the cross county events/training that she will currently be working on.

Once she moves into her sprint/weight training, using the Strength programs on the NMES device will, most definitely be beneficial, as that type of training (conventional and NMES) will look to Type IIa and Type IIb muscle fiber recruitment.

Using the Active Recovery program will greatly help to expedite the healing process as well, so I would recommend that after all the training sessions.

I hope that this reply helps to confirm your training plans and how you will be incorporating your NMES device into the regimen.

If you have any further questions, please let us know!

Happy training!

Casey
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Re: Using EMS for Fall xc, winter/spring sprinting?

Postby rich121 » Mon Aug 13, 2012 8:40 pm

Hello Casey and others,

Today is my daughters first day of cross country.

I am looking for suggestions where to find informaton, charts, periodization for using the distance and recovery settings on the Globus Premium Sport Plus (with "Speed Coach Plus" programming upgrade).

She is having to play "catch-up" as she sprinted in summer AAU/USATF track while the cross country team got an early start.

Your help is greatly appreciated!
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Re: Using EMS for Fall xc, winter/spring sprinting?

Postby jbruskewitz » Tue Aug 14, 2012 5:39 pm

Hi RIch,

Your idea of using the endurance programs to train her Type I slow twitch muscle fibers now is a good one. Not only will she be able to reduce the amount of neural inhibition she has, but she can increase the number and size of mitochondria, the organelles that house the aerobic enzymes. The result: she will be able to recruit more slow twitch muscle fibers and the fibers will be able to deliver more energy for the contractions while running.

Your daughter will start to notice the increased recruitment in two to three weeks. The amount of muscle fiber available for recruitment while running will increase for up to eight weeks. The enzymatic changes within the muscle fibers will take on the order of six weeks to kick in, and reasonable gains can be expected for twelve weeks. You can see that three weeks of training is minimal and 12 weeks of EMS endurance training is enough. The training block should include three sessions per week for this three to twelve week period.

After the endurance block is completed and your daughter begins the transition to sprinting, she would be well-served if she did a 5 week block of resistance programs three times per week on her quadriceps and gluteals. After completing this five week block, another 5 week block of strength programs performed three times per week will round out her strength training for the 400 meters.

This kind of simple plan with a regular progression through the various strength programs will yield excellent results when combined with her regular run training. Your daughter is a real talent. EMS can only help her.

Jim
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Re: Using EMS for Fall xc, winter/spring sprinting?

Postby rich121 » Thu Aug 16, 2012 1:36 am

Jim,

Thank you so very much for the hugely informative reply!

One more question.

With the 3 day a week Endurance Training, what would you recommend for recovery, and what type of workouts would I use the Endurance Training after and which type of workouts should I use the Recovery Program (if recommended) after?

Hope that makes sense...

Again, thank you so much!

Rick
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Re: Using EMS for Fall xc, winter/spring sprinting?

Postby casey-becker » Fri Aug 17, 2012 12:22 pm

Hi Rick,

I'll be 'short and sweet' with this one.

As mentioned in my first reply to you, whatever you are doing conventionally in your training (or her training), you would want to 'mirror' with the Compex. So, Endurance program on Compex after Endurance workout.

Following any and all training routines, both conventional and/or Compex, with the Recovery program(s) would be a great idea.

I hope this helps! If you need more, please let us know!

Casey
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Re: Using EMS for Fall xc, winter/spring sprinting?

Postby divadean » Sat Aug 18, 2012 9:40 pm

I asked Derek Hansen, a coach friend of mine and who is an EMS expert, about this and he was of a very different advice. There is a cost attached to training aerobic based systems in young developing athletes - primarily the potential for Type 2 fibers to convert to Type 1.
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Re: Using EMS for Fall xc, winter/spring sprinting?

Postby casey-becker » Tue Aug 21, 2012 12:58 pm

Hi divadean,

Thank you for your comments. With all due respect to you and to your friend, Derek Hansen, I would politely say that we respectfully disagree. I have been conversing with our EMS expert, Jim Bruskewitz, and simply put, one cannot convert Type II muscle fibers to Type I muscle fibers, or vice-versa. If you can re-wire muscle fibers they will convert, but the only way to do this is surgically. This has never been done on humans, as it wouldn't be effective given what is required with the procedure.

Thank you again, for your comments. If you would like to discuss this further, either I or Jim would be happy to do so.

Casey
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Re: Using EMS for Fall xc, winter/spring sprinting?

Postby wermouth » Wed Aug 22, 2012 2:42 pm

rich121

What you should do first is to design/ write 400m program!!!

The next step would be to apply all the necessary and available tools with in and around that program

With all the respect to my earlier speakers, EMS will help you but will not do the WORK for you, what I mean that EMS should be treated as an extra, NEVER as a main tool in Fitness Components DEVELOPMENT.
You are right to what you wrote above, having said that you cannot have the same approach to 400m training with EMS, as most of Fat reducing EMS tool adverts (sit on your back side, plug it in and you’ll lose weight)

One more time, planning of whole season and then individual track sessions has to come before EMS
EMS is a great tool, we all agree with it
Please remember that your daughter just turned 15!!!
I would see EMS as a good of track recovery tool

regards
wermouth
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Re: Using EMS for Fall xc, winter/spring sprinting?

Postby wermouth » Wed Aug 22, 2012 4:14 pm

casey-becker

“one cannot convert Type II muscle fibers to Type I muscle fibers, or vice-versa”

"The predominance of slow or fast-twitch fibers gives its name to a muscle when one of the two contains a percentage above 70% (Jonson). With training, it’s possible to convert super fast fibers to others which are slightly faster or slower; but it is impossible to directly change type I fibers to type IIb and vice versa" FUNCTIONAL ELECTRICAL STIMULATION
(F.E.S.) IN STROKE
Juan Nicolás Cuenca & Eric Lazar, Physiotherapists


Its mean that Type IIa can go either way, Type IIa can became more like a Type I or go other direction to become more like Type IIb or Type IIx if you prefer, depends on type of work been stimulated with

Also have you read:
Neuromuscular electrical stimulation training induces atypical adaptations of the human skeletal muscle phenotype: a functional and proteomic analysis
Julien Gondin, Lorenza Brocca, Elena Bellinzona, Giuseppe D’Antona, Nicola A. Maffiuletti, Danilo Miotti, Maria A. Pellegrino, and Roberto Bottinelli

"The atypical adaptations of the muscle phenotype by NMES are characteristic of both resistance (i.e.,strength gains) and endurance (i.e., fast-to-slow and glycolyticto-oxidative conversion) training and can be mainly ascribed to the specific motor unit recruitment pattern"

Regards
wermouth
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