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Combination of perpetuem and solid food for 16 hour race

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Combination of perpetuem and solid food for 16 hour race

Postby sveske » Sun Nov 14, 2010 8:38 am

I am planning to rely primarily on perpetuem for a 16/17 hour hill running race (100 km) but am not uncertain after having read some of the articles on this web site how much solid food I can have.
The temperature will be around 20-24 degrees celcious and 60-80% humidity.
I plan to drink approx 750 ml per hour.
I also plan to take endurolytes (although I have not tried them before and usually dont take much sodium tablets)

My questions are
How much solid food is recommended?
Is it advisable to drink the perpetuem as a multi hour bottle? My weight is 51 kg.
How much endurolytes is recommended if I drink perpetuem every hour?

Many thanks!
Lisa
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Re: Combination of perpetuem and solid food for 16 hour race

Postby steve-born » Thu Nov 18, 2010 11:39 am

Hello Lisa -

I'm a big fan of the concentrated, multi-hour bottle(s) of Perpetuem for the following reasons:

1) I don't have to drink so much flavored liquid hour after hour.

2) I can drink and enjoy plain water to take care of my hydration needs.

3) Because I'm in essence keeping my calories coming in from a source independent of my fluids, it allows me to adjust the dose of either one independently. For example, in a hot-weather race my ability to process calories will probably diminish while my fluid needs will most likely increase. By having my calories independent of my fluid source, it allows me to drink more fluid without concurrently taking in more calories.

4) I believe (and this is just a theory of mine) that pre-mixed bottles of concentrated Perpetuem last longer in warmer weather. My rationale is that because less water is being used and the mixture is more concentrated, it doesn't degrade nearly as quickly (this is just what I've found in my own personal use, though I have received the same feedback from others).

So yes, I would highly recommend you give the multi-hour bottle of Perpetuem a try.

20C - 24C translates to 68F - 75F so it's not going to be too terribly warm. As such, I think that you can make an 8-hour bottle with no problem in terms of palatability and stability, especially if you are able to freeze the pre-mixed bottle the night before (if not, no worries... just make it the night before and put it in the fridge or make it in the morning using ice water and perhaps a couple of ice cubes). Also, if you use the caffe latter flavor of Perpetuem I think you will find it to be more palatable when it gets a bit warm, at least in comparison to the orange-vanilla flavor.

At your weight, I think that 1 scoop/hour would be just fine and you should be able to make an 8-hour bottle without too much hassle. Just start with some water first, add a scoop or two, put the top on, shake, and repeat until you've got your 8-hour bottle. Then, I'd suggest you mark the bottle (using a Sharpie pen) in eighths so that you will have a visual gauge as to how much you should be consuming hourly.

The main problem people have with multi-hour bottles is that they drink too much of it too quickly. Remember, you're going to have eight hours of fuel in that one bottle so you only need to drink 1/8 of it ever hour... sip on it, don't chug it down!

750 ml/hour (about 25 ounces/hour) is fine, though you may find that you might not need quite that much. At your weight (51kg = 112 lbs) you may find that 750 ml/hour may be a bit on the high side and that a smaller amount of 550 ml - 600 ml (approximately 18.5 oz - 20 oz) per hour will serve you well.

As far as Endurolytes are concerned, I suggest that you start with 1 capsule hourly, with the understanding that you can and should increase that dose immediately if you feel a twinge of a cramp coming on. Our normal suggested amount is 1 capsule per 50-60 lbs of body weight but since you've not used the product before, start with 1 capsule per hour and increase as needed, if needed.

Solid food is a luxury, not a necessity, though I say that with the knowledge that going "liquid only" is, to some degree, an acquired skill. I have done enough ultra stuff over the years so that I've been able to go for 24 hours on an all-liquid diet. That said, while there is no "hard and fast" rule for solid food consumption, you do want to use it rather sparingly, if only so that your body doesn't have to work so hard digesting the solid food.

One thing I learned the hard way is that when athletes consume too much solid food too frequently, they tend to feel lethargic, almost sleepy. That's because some of the blood, water, and electrolytes are being diverted away from the working muscles and to the digestive tract, all for the purpose of helping to break down and digest the solid food.

So with all that said, feel free to consume some solid food on occasion (fruit, such as bananas, pears, and melons are always a good choice. I also believe that raw nuts, especially almonds and walnuts, are excellent choices). Consider also the occasional use of the Hammer Bar and/or Perpetuem Solids. Those too are also very good choices. As far as how frequently you consume solid food, this is based on personal preference as well as one's ability to go "all liquid" for "X" number of hours. I typically suggest that one use solid food as a reward of sorts ("when I get to mile marker whatever, I'm going to have a bagel")... that kind of thing. What I wouldn't do is rely too heavily on it; remember, it's not a necessity, it's a luxury. So with that in mind, assuming you've not gone "all liquid" before, I would suggest that you consume a little solid food every four hours of the 16 that you're going to be out there.

I know this is a lot of information to digest (no pun intended) but I hope you will find it useful. Please post back if I have forgotten anything or if you have additional questions.

Good luck in your race!

Sincerely -

Steve
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www.hammernutrition.com
800.336.1977
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Re: Combination of perpetuem and solid food for 16 hour race

Postby PowerGoat » Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:06 pm

Hello Lisa,

I would suggest that if the temps do look like they'll be in the range you mentioned, to go with a 4-hour bottle instead of the 8. With that heat, plus the shaking of the bottle (a runners problem, but not a cyclists) over that time period, the Perpetuem could get pretty riled up. 68-75*F is warm for a long, continuous run (while great for cycling), and if you're going to need 16 hours for 100k, you're probably going to be living in the hills as well. I think the 4-hour bottle will be less likely to give you troubles if it is that warm. Just a suggestion.

Also, I would second what Steve wrote about keeping it under 600 mL/hr. I think for your weight, 750 is way too high.

When running, desiring solid food is real, but eating it can be a hassle. Your body will not "need" solid food in a 16 hour run. It can get by very well without it...so don't get all worked up about it. Stick with Perpetuem, HEED, and water. Alternate with Sustained Energy with Hammer Gel and water, or with just Hammer Gel and water. You'll have plenty to do without needing to wonder if you're going to be sick or not. If you feel like you want to have solid food, then consider a Hammer Bar or a banana or a potato. Maybe a little fruit--watermelon is usually easy to deal with--but don't stuff yourself. You will need a lot less than you think you'll need. Here's one catchy phrase to remember: your body might want solid food, but it will work better with liquids only. Anything that is solid food will be harder for your body to process than anything that is a Hammer liquid.
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